was contacted to wash a brick building that just went under some renovations. In the photos you will see the old brick and white paint on the bricks as well... they must have painted in the wind. I don't think this is a soft wash job... I'm thinking it may really need power washing an an acid wash.... thoughts.
Thanks Doug, I am going to try a test spot tomorrow.
Maverick Contracting said
Jan 20, 2017
Agreed, try softwash first but if it's more than Gloe than step it up with a stronger mix like sodium mescalate (fake TSP since TSP is banned here) With smooth brick SW with garden hose pressure usually is fine but deep pitted, coarse type brick I've found still needs higher pressure to clean out the "nooks & crannies"
-- Edited by Maverick Contracting on Friday 20th of January 2017 11:15:35 AM
Fred W said
Jan 20, 2017
Great job for a booster pump. Great for spraying the mix and has some added pressure for the rinse with no fear of damage.
Patrick G said
Jan 20, 2017
Do the booster pumps come " on demand " or still no?
Fred W said
Jan 20, 2017
No, but you can put a pressure switch on them. I don't use a pressure switch but I also don't allow the pump to run for more than a minute or two before I relieve the pressure. The problem is the heat generated and not pressure. You should not use PVC parts at the pump. Instead use brass fittings.
PVC will heat up and become soft.....then pow.....mix goes everywhere....:}
Patrick G said
Jan 20, 2017
lol, ok thank you. I watched your video on soft washing bricks. Nice job on making that video
Jeff Wible said
Jan 21, 2017
Anytime you can softwash brick it is a plus. Brick and mortar done in the last 50 years will many times will handle the higher PSI without issue,.At face value that is,....But the problem comes after you leave,..when high PSI (2000-3000) is used on brick there is a possibility it will cause efflorescence down the road. A fan pattern and 1000 PSI is usually not an issue,..and is still enough to help remove some of the more embedded grunge.
But I've had people call and ask me what the "white" stuff is on their brick,..I tell them it's likely efflorescence and confirm when I get there,...and almost everytime it's because someone or they themselves power washed the brick with high PSI,..they just didn't realize that's how efflorescence can happen.
Most anything on brick can be removed chemically and a little patience and not have to use high PSI.
*In fact,..many pressure washer people should feel lucky customers aren't aware of what caused the unsightly patchy white haze all over their house or building,..not sure what would happen but I could see lawsuits being brought to some pressure washer services. Because efflorescence is a never ending cycle,..and can be removed,..and will come right back,..best thing to do is apply a wet look sealer to hide it.
Jeff
-- Edited by Jeff Wible on Saturday 21st of January 2017 06:50:49 AM
Maverick Contracting said
Jan 21, 2017
Jeff, there are also brick sealers that are NOT "wet look" but matte so the bricks look like regular old bricks but are water proof and will retard effervescence as long as there's no hydrostatic pressure behind them.
G re eat upsell too especially if you sell an antigraffiti coating
Jeff Wible said
Jan 21, 2017
Hey Maverick,..yea,.the matte would be better for sure. Will keep that in mind,..thanks!
Jeff
Patrick G said
Jan 21, 2017
Great information Jeff and Maverick. I tried several test spots today on this building with a 50/50 mix with negative results. Don't get me wrong the green algae died but not this deep embedded black in the crevasses, even after rinsing nothing budged. I left a coat of mix on to dwell over night I will check it in the morning. I think I am going to pass on the job for several reasons # 1 It really is out of my ability, it needs experience that I just don't have at this time, as Clint Eastwood once said " A man has to know his limitations # 2 It is a large three story building, where the painters have gotten paint splattered all over the bricks. #3 It is right on the corner of a busy street with business, shopping, restaurants and constant pedestrian and vehicular traffic, today pedestrian traffic was an issue just for the test spot. It may be best to drape the building working behind a wall keeping it from getting airborne. I have a close up of the black on the bricks I will try to post below.
-- Edited by Patrick G on Saturday 21st of January 2017 05:12:00 PM
Looks like type of old bricks may have a manufactured "glaze". There are so many different types of bricks and a good Mason should be able to match. Then there are atmospheric and automobile carbon deposits that softwashing and regular mix won't work.
It needs to be chemically dissolved and pressure washed
Fred W said
Jan 21, 2017
I agree, that's not algae....
Patrick G said
Jan 21, 2017
Funny Maverick it is on a busy street and very close to the roadway....I was thinking to my self its like built up car exhaust.
Jeff Wible said
Jan 22, 2017
Hey Patrick,.unless that "blackening" is part of the bricks color,..which I doubt ,....what you're showing in the picture needs acid washed with a product like Diedrich 101,..I'm sure there are other products as well. Actually,..an aluminum brightener with HF will work. I have done probably 15 or so of these brick jobs over the years,..and to do them "right" takes a chemical designed for the job.
If you would use the proper cleaner at a a strong mixture 1:3 or even 50/50 ,..you could use around 1000 PSI to remove the embedded darkening. You could actually use less PSI,.but using more PSI allows you to take a wider swath and be effective,..so in reality,..what would be hitting the surface would be more like 400-500 PSI I suppose,..that's just a guess,..but you know what I mean.
The next time I do one I am going to two-step with acid and then the Purple Power over that,..I think it will work the same as any other two-stepping.
Now,.with what you described as to what the job entails,..I'd either make a good plan,..and definitely charge enough. Worse you can do is not get the job. Is how I look at these,Or,.I'd walk. And do it in the rain if possible!!
I have acid washed numerous vinyl houses in congested areas this way, vinyl houses get that same grunge on them ,..usually shows up under the soffit,..but I have done many houses where almost the whole houses needed acid washed,..in fact I have one starting up this next season. Regular house wash chemicals will not remove this grunge I'm talking about. Many times it will only be under the soffit or on any siding that may be under roof and has collected this grunge over the years,..sometimes I'll just dip a brush and run it over the bad areas,..doesn't always need sprayed. But I have been two-stepping them mostly these days,..takes a lot of work out of it.
Due to the HF use proper PPE.
*As mentioned above,..when I do these acid washes,..I always do them in the rain,..keeps everything wet,..keeps the acid misting knocked down,..and best of all,..there aren't as many people out walking around. May not always work out due to lack of rain,..but I try to do them in the rain.
**The first few brick jobs were in congested areas,..and we applied the acid with rollers,..Ha,Ha,..what a PITA.
***Two-stepping also neutralizes the acid.
Jeff
-- Edited by Jeff Wible on Sunday 22nd of January 2017 04:55:19 PM
Pat, Maybe using hot water or steam would facilitate cleaning?
Jeff, you ever try hot water for atmospheric brick crud?
Jeff Wible said
Jan 22, 2017
Hey Maverick,..I did years ago,.but it was only slightly better and not enough to sell as a restoration cleaning. The acid is still needed and the water,.cold or hot is physically removing the loosened crud,..the heat is a moot point.
The acid just makes the job simple as far as performance goes,..there are precautions in procedure though.
I'm sure there are instances where hot water would help,..but as a whole,..I think the acid would still be needed to get to super clean.
Jeff
Patrick G said
Jan 22, 2017
Thank's Jeff that was a lot of good information in helping make my decision. I think the job is just to much for me at this time so I'm going to pass on it but i will make the suggestions you all pointed out. Thanks everyone for the feedback, much appreciated.
Jeff Wible said
Jan 22, 2017
Yea, Patrick,.you won't regret walking,...these jobs can be messy,..and turn into more than you expect,..even when you expect the worse, Ha,Ha,..
Jeff
Art O said
Jan 22, 2017
Fresh paint to, May turn into that green slim!!!!
Patrick G said
Jan 22, 2017
Yes could turn out to be a nightmare, I hooked up with this outfit late last year gave me three jobs. Then called me last week asking about this building. I have two jobs to do for them this spring and I am hoping for a lot of flat work. I think going,looking and being straight up is much better then an attempt,fail and have to explain it.
was contacted to wash a brick building that just went under some renovations. In the photos you will see the old brick and white paint on the bricks as well... they must have painted in the wind. I don't think this is a soft wash job... I'm thinking it may really need power washing an an acid wash.... thoughts.
Some other photos
Art even when I rotate them they still post sideways as well. Hmmm
Pat, I use Enviro klean from PROSOCO once.
Borrowed from cousin but I know Sherwilliams carries their products so you can ask them to order it
-- Edited by Maverick Contracting on Thursday 19th of January 2017 07:46:45 PM
Except for the paint splatter I would soft wash all the way. The results will be better and last longer.
Sorry, the system changed the order the pictures go in
-- Edited by Baton Rouge Roof Cleaner on Friday 20th of January 2017 09:26:41 AM
Agreed, try softwash first but if it's more than Gloe than step it up with a stronger mix like sodium mescalate (fake TSP since TSP is banned here) With smooth brick SW with garden hose pressure usually is fine but deep pitted, coarse type brick I've found still needs higher pressure to clean out the "nooks & crannies"
-- Edited by Maverick Contracting on Friday 20th of January 2017 11:15:35 AM
Do the booster pumps come " on demand " or still no?
PVC will heat up and become soft.....then pow.....mix goes everywhere....:}
Anytime you can softwash brick it is a plus. Brick and mortar done in the last 50 years will many times will handle the higher PSI without issue,.At face value that is,....But the problem comes after you leave,..when high PSI (2000-3000) is used on brick there is a possibility it will cause efflorescence down the road. A fan pattern and 1000 PSI is usually not an issue,..and is still enough to help remove some of the more embedded grunge.
But I've had people call and ask me what the "white" stuff is on their brick,..I tell them it's likely efflorescence and confirm when I get there,...and almost everytime it's because someone or they themselves power washed the brick with high PSI,..they just didn't realize that's how efflorescence can happen.
Most anything on brick can be removed chemically and a little patience and not have to use high PSI.
*In fact,..many pressure washer people should feel lucky customers aren't aware of what caused the unsightly patchy white haze all over their house or building,..not sure what would happen but I could see lawsuits being brought to some pressure washer services. Because efflorescence is a never ending cycle,..and can be removed,..and will come right back,..best thing to do is apply a wet look sealer to hide it.
Jeff
-- Edited by Jeff Wible on Saturday 21st of January 2017 06:50:49 AM
G re eat upsell too especially if you sell an antigraffiti coating
Hey Maverick,..yea,.the matte would be better for sure. Will keep that in mind,..thanks!
Jeff
Great information Jeff and Maverick. I tried several test spots today on this building with a 50/50 mix with negative results. Don't get me wrong the green algae died but not this deep embedded black in the crevasses, even after rinsing nothing budged. I left a coat of mix on to dwell over night I will check it in the morning. I think I am going to pass on the job for several reasons # 1 It really is out of my ability, it needs experience that I just don't have at this time, as Clint Eastwood once said " A man has to know his limitations # 2 It is a large three story building, where the painters have gotten paint splattered all over the bricks. #3 It is right on the corner of a busy street with business, shopping, restaurants and constant pedestrian and vehicular traffic, today pedestrian traffic was an issue just for the test spot. It may be best to drape the building working behind a wall keeping it from getting airborne. I have a close up of the black on the bricks I will try to post below.
-- Edited by Patrick G on Saturday 21st of January 2017 05:12:00 PM
It needs to be chemically dissolved and pressure washed
Hey Patrick,.unless that "blackening" is part of the bricks color,..which I doubt ,....what you're showing in the picture needs acid washed with a product like Diedrich 101,..I'm sure there are other products as well. Actually,..an aluminum brightener with HF will work. I have done probably 15 or so of these brick jobs over the years,..and to do them "right" takes a chemical designed for the job.
If you would use the proper cleaner at a a strong mixture 1:3 or even 50/50 ,..you could use around 1000 PSI to remove the embedded darkening. You could actually use less PSI,.but using more PSI allows you to take a wider swath and be effective,..so in reality,..what would be hitting the surface would be more like 400-500 PSI I suppose,..that's just a guess,..but you know what I mean.
The next time I do one I am going to two-step with acid and then the Purple Power over that,..I think it will work the same as any other two-stepping.
Now,.with what you described as to what the job entails,..I'd either make a good plan,..and definitely charge enough. Worse you can do is not get the job. Is how I look at these,Or,.I'd walk. And do it in the rain if possible!!
I have acid washed numerous vinyl houses in congested areas this way, vinyl houses get that same grunge on them ,..usually shows up under the soffit,..but I have done many houses where almost the whole houses needed acid washed,..in fact I have one starting up this next season. Regular house wash chemicals will not remove this grunge I'm talking about. Many times it will only be under the soffit or on any siding that may be under roof and has collected this grunge over the years,..sometimes I'll just dip a brush and run it over the bad areas,..doesn't always need sprayed. But I have been two-stepping them mostly these days,..takes a lot of work out of it.
Due to the HF use proper PPE.
*As mentioned above,..when I do these acid washes,..I always do them in the rain,..keeps everything wet,..keeps the acid misting knocked down,..and best of all,..there aren't as many people out walking around. May not always work out due to lack of rain,..but I try to do them in the rain.
**The first few brick jobs were in congested areas,..and we applied the acid with rollers,..Ha,Ha,..what a PITA.
***Two-stepping also neutralizes the acid.
Jeff
-- Edited by Jeff Wible on Sunday 22nd of January 2017 04:55:19 PM
Jeff, you ever try hot water for atmospheric brick crud?
The acid just makes the job simple as far as performance goes,..there are precautions in procedure though.
I'm sure there are instances where hot water would help,..but as a whole,..I think the acid would still be needed to get to super clean.
Jeff
Jeff