Hey guys, so I got turned onto this Proportionerand other comparable systems. Seems like an awesome idea. I got to looking into the design and parts (as far as I can tell) and I got excited. I thought "hey I can build this same style set up with parts I had laying around the shop". I was very skeptical of my new project because I didn't know if my home build would work very well. I built it before we opened for the season and I now have about 55 houses under my belt with this home made system and it works amazingly. For just 6 easy monthly payments of $19.99 I will teach you how I did it. But wait there's more.... Lol jk. I used three 90° ball valves from Ace Hardware, 1 water tank with an in line one way check valve to keep soap and chemicals out of the water tank, 1 soap tank and 1 pure chemical tank. Half of this was already there from my batch mixing days anyhow. It took me about 4 days to get the hang of where the ball valves would be set for different exteriors but it was super simple. Water is always full open and the soap stays relatively the same most of the time. The chemical was trickier but just a tad. Fully open is about 6%, 66% open is 4% and 33% open is 2%. You can also run from 8% to pure bleach by shutting the water line. Now someone is going to say that I can't be 100% correct on these numbers and they are probably correct. However this cheap system cost me about $25 in parts not already on the trailer and works as good as I'm assuming the other systems would. Only big difference is my ball valves are $7 and theirs are $260 for click style ball valves. They are very accurate but is the need to have it within a half of a percent worth $1200 bucks plus? I didn't think so and I made this. Let me know your thoughts. Hopefully I can help the community with this cheap, easy diy system.
Bryan P said
Apr 7, 2017
I like my proportioner much, I'd probably pay double for it. Sure, you could rig something to work, but the Proportioneris bulletproof...the valves are VERY accurate and results are repeatable. It is also extremely easy to train employees how to use it because there's no guess work. I did rig mine with an additional 3 way valve to switch between the soap tank and a soap drop tube I can put in a bucket if I want to use something different.
Liberty SoftWash said
Apr 7, 2017
Bryan P wrote:
I like my proportioner much, I'd probably pay double for it. Sure, you could rig something to work, but the Proportioneris bulletproof...the valves are VERY accurate and results are repeatable. It is also extremely easy to train employees how to use it because there's no guess work. I did rig mine with an additional 3 way valve to switch between the soap tank and a soap drop tube I can put in a bucket if I want to use something different.
All day long! Just bought 2nd one.
xtrememustang21 said
Apr 7, 2017
I understand completely Bryan. If it works and is bulletproof why change it. I just wanted to share what I did in case someone was holding off using a system like that because of the price tag. This method would get you the time savings for a fraction of the cost. You are right though that employees might have a harder time learning this way. I'm a much smaller business so I am onsite for every job still.
Diamond Roof Cleaning said
Apr 7, 2017
Please change your avatar to either a pic of yourself or your company logo.
Diamond Roof Cleaning said
Apr 7, 2017
Thank you.
xtrememustang21 said
Apr 7, 2017
You're welcome Michael.
Roof Cleaning Virginia said
Apr 7, 2017
I'm with you Jared. I think I have a total of $10 in mine (PVC). And it's employee proof. We should compare notes one day. I think Art O made his out of galvanized, and a buddy of mine made one out of stainless.
Zach Maynard said
Apr 7, 2017
I built my own, but opted to buy one. Its badass and looks professional which is always important to me.
xtrememustang21 said
Apr 7, 2017
Hey Ted, comparing notes would be great. We could see if we could tweak anything to make them better! Zach I agree but doing it the way I did actually would be less on the trailer which would give a cleaner more streamlined appearance I'd say. But professionalism is very important to be sure!
Art O said
Apr 7, 2017
Roof Cleaning Virginia wrote:
I'm with you Jared. I think I have a total of $10 in mine (PVC). And it's employee proof. We should compare notes one day. I think Art O made his out of galvanized, and a buddy of mine made one out of stainless.
No Galvanized here
xtrememustang21 said
Apr 7, 2017
Mine is all braided hose with pvc fittings except for the ball valves sitting on top of my chemical and soap tanks. They all tie together and go into the pump. No stainless or galvanised at all.
Jeff Wible said
Apr 7, 2017
Many people have built these proportioning units over the last few years. It's actually very common,..just not openly talked about that much. I think it's much to do with the respect people have for Tim Asleton. And kudos to him for being able to market a tool, that helps many.
Chris Tucker was talking about doing it 8-10 years ago and I think it spurred some into going forward with the idea. And I don't blame them,.it's a great idea.
Jeff
xtrememustang21 said
Apr 7, 2017
Hey Jeff, I assumed I couldn't be the only one to have tried it but I couldn't find anything at all in the forum. I was curious if I was the only one. I don't want to step on Tim's toes if he's a part of this site here. I was just trying to help others if I can with my trial and error at perfecting this diy set up.
Brian C Jackson said
Apr 7, 2017
There is no law against building our own equipment. I think as time goes buy and we as owners get busier we have less time to build our own rigs.
Fred W said
Apr 7, 2017
I bought two initially then built two. I ended up giving away the two I built and buying two more...so here's my take.
If I were just starting out and needed a system yet could not afford one then sure, I'd build it. Being successful takes hard work, dedication and professionalism (or luck). The Mainifold I built worked great but lack that luster and professionalism I require.
My cost to build one was about $600 and not $25. Sure, you can use a cheap valve but that's just too risky. They just wont hold up....period. At $600 I feel I lost money because of my time and my build was no where near as professional. I'll never turn back. I will buy two more by the years end and smile as Paul and Tim take my cash.
Jeff Wible said
Apr 8, 2017
Brian C Jackson wrote:
There is no law against building our own equipment. I think as time goes buy and we as owners get busier we have less time to build our own rigs.
Hey Brian,.yea,..I agree with that whole heartily,..anyone that's seen my posts over the years knows that I love reverse engineering,.and even engineering using the "wing-it" method. But I know Tim has been around these boards for a long time and wasn't a vendor,..and still offered up advice the same as many of us do. Like I said,..on my part anyhow,.it's just a matter of respect not to get into the weeds of the build on a Manifold that was developed for market by one of our peers. But,..yes I built one as well,..and I would normally be sharing my own build and and ideas openly (As I have with other things) ,..but hat was done through private messages with others that un-selfishly gave me the ideas to build it.
*I figured it's just a matter of time untill it gets wide open popular to build them yourself,..figured I'd not be part of the onslaught of info.
Jeff
BlueRidge said
Apr 8, 2017
I built one because I build everything. That's why I get people like Jeff & Art. More than 25.00 and less than 600.00. The final came in around 300.00 with less than an hour labor. The white plug is gone and the fresh water comes in to prime the pump. Thanks to Trey for the parts list.
I aslo believe the proportioner a very professional piece of equipment and I will probably just buy my next one . But I think it's a good idea to share this info with new business start ups that dont have the budget to do an expensive build. I also think this is a good thread.
Fred W said
Apr 8, 2017
BlueRidge wrote:
I built one because I build everything. That's why I get people like Jeff & Art. More than 25.00 and less than 600.00. The final came in around 300.00 with less than an hour labor. The white plug is gone and the fresh water comes in to prime the pump. Thanks to Trey for the parts list.
Looks good Brett!
Diamond Roof Cleaning said
Apr 8, 2017
Here the one i built with my sws skid.
-- Edited by Diamond Roof Cleaning on Saturday 8th of April 2017 03:26:47 PM
Here's the one I built, Works fine and I enjoyed building it over the winter. I went with $20 discontinued valves on Ebay and marked the body with different colors to dial it in. I keep it in a 5' tool box with my Pumps, battery and soaps and a bunch of other daily Chit that I need during the day
SprayWash said
Apr 10, 2017
I've purposely not responded to this thread for couple of day to gather my thoughts... but i think I'm ready to share now. You want to know my thoughts: I think its crap to go out and publicly discuss how to violate a patent. Especially here on the general open forum. This isn't some private off the beaten path BBS, this site ranks nationally and this thread isn't even on the private side.
Now let me soften my stance and explain my reasoning;
1) Tim is a very good friend of mine. When he invented the Mainifold, I begged him to take it to market as I knew it was a tool that would help cleaners and revolutionize the industry. I was not an easy task to get him to do this, and sadly from the moment he "put himself out there" there been people walking all over his intellectual property rights and trying to screw him out profiting on what he's legally protected, researched and developed. IN full and fair disclosure, I am not a disinterested observer who is unbiassed.
2) If Jeff W. patented a downstreaming device (which we know he loves) i'd feel the same way about protecting his rights, Also, because since he's a friend, I would try and help him market that product if he was taking it to market. I like trying to help my friends. LIkewise if Art revolutionized the siding industry with an incredible new tool, I wouldn't be out in public forums discussing how to beat his system.
3) It is correct to say that we've always tried to reverse engineer products and do things cheaper, better and sometimes just because we like innovation and doing things ourselves. Its cool, i get it, but I don't think the actual process/and step by step how to guide needs to be discussed on a public forum. If I had the formulation for Dragon Juice I wouldn't be out publicly sharing it, I might give a buddy a PM about it, but I wouldn't go out publicly stating it!
4) I can't help but wonder if we don't (as the NWSA) somehow have some liability toward the Mainifold, the Powerwash Store ( the MFG and distributor) and Tim Aselton (the owner and inventor) for hosting this info.
5) I figure my time is worth about $70/hr (at least thats what the W-2 portion of my compensation says). Running the rigs comes in at well over 2K per day, 365 days per year. As my company has grown, I just don't have the time to build and innovate anymore. I used to build my rigs but now days I can't afford to anymore. But when my company was smaller, I couldn't afford to buy rigs. Theres nothing wrong with building your own stuff. Theres' nothing wrong with tweaking things you buy. Its called innovation and happens in every industry.
6) I know its "just the Mainifold", but let me show this in a different light. What if we were talking about Coke, and I said, here's something just as good as Coke, and here's how you make it, and also used the Coke name during all of my discussions. How fast do you think I would have a team of lawyers suing my AZZ off? There's a reason we have patents and copyrights, to protect inventors and innovators who choose to risk their finances and go to the open market. Any one of us could try and build a proportioning device, but legally we can't say I'm going to build a Mainifold.
As others have stated, Tim has been a long time innovator, participant, and friend to many in this industry. I don't think its cool to target this inventor by name and try to circumvent the way he makes a living. He is much more classy and diplomatic than I am, and probably wont come here to tell you how he feels about this. For example, the booster pumps. Tim doesn't make one single cent from the sale or promotion of any booster pump, yet he spends 10-20 hours per week conversing with people about them, and helping them fine tune their rigs ( even with people without Mainifolds, some even have homemade PROPORTIONING devices.) Thats just the classy kind of guy he is. He firmly believes in his heart its the best delivery system for softwashing.
BlueRidge said
Apr 10, 2017
Ray has a point. I just moved the thread.
Art O said
Apr 10, 2017
Thanks for moving the thread Brett. I wanted to do that the other day and you guys bitched. Ray you have the power to move any thread you don't like or think it shouldn't be in the open
-- Edited by Admin on Monday 10th of April 2017 10:56:23 PM
Diamond Roof Cleaning said
Apr 11, 2017
Well i see both sides of this as well. I own an actual pro portioner and i have made my own mixing manifold. Unfortunately tim dosent have the patent rights on the gp metering valves. So anyone can use them and configure them for their system without legal worries. As long as they arent calling them Mainifolds then their fine.
Now with that said Tim's pro portioner is the bomb. It looks good and functions just right everytime. I most likely will be buying another one becuase like ray said i just dont have time to tinker around.
Hey guys, so I got turned onto this Proportionerand other comparable systems. Seems like an awesome idea. I got to looking into the design and parts (as far as I can tell) and I got excited. I thought "hey I can build this same style set up with parts I had laying around the shop". I was very skeptical of my new project because I didn't know if my home build would work very well. I built it before we opened for the season and I now have about 55 houses under my belt with this home made system and it works amazingly. For just 6 easy monthly payments of $19.99 I will teach you how I did it. But wait there's more.... Lol jk. I used three 90° ball valves from Ace Hardware, 1 water tank with an in line one way check valve to keep soap and chemicals out of the water tank, 1 soap tank and 1 pure chemical tank. Half of this was already there from my batch mixing days anyhow. It took me about 4 days to get the hang of where the ball valves would be set for different exteriors but it was super simple. Water is always full open and the soap stays relatively the same most of the time. The chemical was trickier but just a tad. Fully open is about 6%, 66% open is 4% and 33% open is 2%. You can also run from 8% to pure bleach by shutting the water line. Now someone is going to say that I can't be 100% correct on these numbers and they are probably correct. However this cheap system cost me about $25 in parts not already on the trailer and works as good as I'm assuming the other systems would. Only big difference is my ball valves are $7 and theirs are $260 for click style ball valves. They are very accurate but is the need to have it within a half of a percent worth $1200 bucks plus? I didn't think so and I made this. Let me know your thoughts. Hopefully I can help the community with this cheap, easy diy system.
I like my proportioner much, I'd probably pay double for it. Sure, you could rig something to work, but the Proportioneris bulletproof...the valves are VERY accurate and results are repeatable. It is also extremely easy to train employees how to use it because there's no guess work. I did rig mine with an additional 3 way valve to switch between the soap tank and a soap drop tube I can put in a bucket if I want to use something different.
All day long! Just bought 2nd one.
I understand completely Bryan. If it works and is bulletproof why change it. I just wanted to share what I did in case someone was holding off using a system like that because of the price tag. This method would get you the time savings for a fraction of the cost. You are right though that employees might have a harder time learning this way. I'm a much smaller business so I am onsite for every job still.
No Galvanized here
Many people have built these proportioning units over the last few years. It's actually very common,..just not openly talked about that much. I think it's much to do with the respect people have for Tim Asleton. And kudos to him for being able to market a tool, that helps many.
Chris Tucker was talking about doing it 8-10 years ago and I think it spurred some into going forward with the idea. And I don't blame them,.it's a great idea.
Jeff
Hey Jeff, I assumed I couldn't be the only one to have tried it but I couldn't find anything at all in the forum. I was curious if I was the only one. I don't want to step on Tim's toes if he's a part of this site here. I was just trying to help others if I can with my trial and error at perfecting this diy set up.
There is no law against building our own equipment. I think as time goes buy and we as owners get busier we have less time to build our own rigs.
I bought two initially then built two. I ended up giving away the two I built and buying two more...so here's my take.
If I were just starting out and needed a system yet could not afford one then sure, I'd build it. Being successful takes hard work, dedication and professionalism (or luck). The Mainifold I built worked great but lack that luster and professionalism I require.
My cost to build one was about $600 and not $25. Sure, you can use a cheap valve but that's just too risky. They just wont hold up....period. At $600 I feel I lost money because of my time and my build was no where near as professional. I'll never turn back. I will buy two more by the years end and smile as Paul and Tim take my cash.
Hey Brian,.yea,..I agree with that whole heartily,..anyone that's seen my posts over the years knows that I love reverse engineering,.and even engineering using the "wing-it" method. But I know Tim has been around these boards for a long time and wasn't a vendor,..and still offered up advice the same as many of us do. Like I said,..on my part anyhow,.it's just a matter of respect not to get into the weeds of the build on a Manifold that was developed for market by one of our peers. But,..yes I built one as well,..and I would normally be sharing my own build and and ideas openly (As I have with other things) ,..but hat was done through private messages with others that un-selfishly gave me the ideas to build it.
*I figured it's just a matter of time untill it gets wide open popular to build them yourself,..figured I'd not be part of the onslaught of info.
Jeff
I built one because I build everything. That's why I get people like Jeff & Art. More than 25.00 and less than 600.00. The final came in around 300.00 with less than an hour labor. The white plug is gone and the fresh water comes in to prime the pump. Thanks to Trey for the parts list.
I aslo believe the proportioner a very professional piece of equipment and I will probably just buy my next one . But I think it's a good idea to share this info with new business start ups that dont have the budget to do an expensive build. I also think this is a good thread.
Looks good Brett!
Here the one i built with my sws skid.
-- Edited by Diamond Roof Cleaning on Saturday 8th of April 2017 03:26:47 PM
Looks great Mike!
It's interesting to see the number of variations and cost levels.
Not me I just make a phone call and they build it.
Here's the one I built, Works fine and I enjoyed building it over the winter. I went with $20 discontinued valves on Ebay and marked the body with different colors to dial it in. I keep it in a 5' tool box with my Pumps, battery and soaps and a bunch of other daily Chit that I need during the day
I've purposely not responded to this thread for couple of day to gather my thoughts... but i think I'm ready to share now. You want to know my thoughts: I think its crap to go out and publicly discuss how to violate a patent. Especially here on the general open forum. This isn't some private off the beaten path BBS, this site ranks nationally and this thread isn't even on the private side.
Now let me soften my stance and explain my reasoning;
1) Tim is a very good friend of mine. When he invented the Mainifold, I begged him to take it to market as I knew it was a tool that would help cleaners and revolutionize the industry. I was not an easy task to get him to do this, and sadly from the moment he "put himself out there" there been people walking all over his intellectual property rights and trying to screw him out profiting on what he's legally protected, researched and developed. IN full and fair disclosure, I am not a disinterested observer who is unbiassed.
2) If Jeff W. patented a downstreaming device (which we know he loves) i'd feel the same way about protecting his rights, Also, because since he's a friend, I would try and help him market that product if he was taking it to market. I like trying to help my friends. LIkewise if Art revolutionized the siding industry with an incredible new tool, I wouldn't be out in public forums discussing how to beat his system.
3) It is correct to say that we've always tried to reverse engineer products and do things cheaper, better and sometimes just because we like innovation and doing things ourselves. Its cool, i get it, but I don't think the actual process/and step by step how to guide needs to be discussed on a public forum. If I had the formulation for Dragon Juice I wouldn't be out publicly sharing it, I might give a buddy a PM about it, but I wouldn't go out publicly stating it!
4) I can't help but wonder if we don't (as the NWSA) somehow have some liability toward the Mainifold, the Powerwash Store ( the MFG and distributor) and Tim Aselton (the owner and inventor) for hosting this info.
5) I figure my time is worth about $70/hr (at least thats what the W-2 portion of my compensation says). Running the rigs comes in at well over 2K per day, 365 days per year. As my company has grown, I just don't have the time to build and innovate anymore. I used to build my rigs but now days I can't afford to anymore. But when my company was smaller, I couldn't afford to buy rigs. Theres nothing wrong with building your own stuff. Theres' nothing wrong with tweaking things you buy. Its called innovation and happens in every industry.
6) I know its "just the Mainifold", but let me show this in a different light. What if we were talking about Coke, and I said, here's something just as good as Coke, and here's how you make it, and also used the Coke name during all of my discussions. How fast do you think I would have a team of lawyers suing my AZZ off? There's a reason we have patents and copyrights, to protect inventors and innovators who choose to risk their finances and go to the open market. Any one of us could try and build a proportioning device, but legally we can't say I'm going to build a Mainifold.
As others have stated, Tim has been a long time innovator, participant, and friend to many in this industry. I don't think its cool to target this inventor by name and try to circumvent the way he makes a living. He is much more classy and diplomatic than I am, and probably wont come here to tell you how he feels about this. For example, the booster pumps. Tim doesn't make one single cent from the sale or promotion of any booster pump, yet he spends 10-20 hours per week conversing with people about them, and helping them fine tune their rigs ( even with people without Mainifolds, some even have homemade PROPORTIONING devices.) Thats just the classy kind of guy he is. He firmly believes in his heart its the best delivery system for softwashing.
Ray has a point. I just moved the thread.
Thanks for moving the thread Brett. I wanted to do that the other day and you guys bitched. Ray you have the power to move any thread you don't like or think it shouldn't be in the open
-- Edited by Admin on Monday 10th of April 2017 10:56:23 PM
Now with that said Tim's pro portioner is the bomb. It looks good and functions just right everytime. I most likely will be buying another one becuase like ray said i just dont have time to tinker around.